ok I had to look appleeye, well I did like that cola scene, they werent naked if I recall, still you are right. like I said I hate it when I see these “kids” do the shower scene or any other “show the abs scene” now I don’t mean the swimmers or athletes and all.; thanks for your input anyway.
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Thanks for watching my list. I made it precisely because I was surprised by this Asian phenomenon: boys are lust objects in stead of girls.
I thought this shower trend would soon fade away, like other trends use to do, but this one seems a keeper. The immense popular Moon Lovers Scarlet Heart Ryeo series paid respect to the tradition in the very first episode, with a huge bathing scene for all the male stars including a follow up with the male lead Lee Joon-Gi in the next episode. This can’t be a coincidence, it is based on monitoring viewers counts and heat maps on line, meant to discover the true sentiments of paying customers.
ok one more and it isnt a shower scene, but on the tennis court, one of the ladies switched her top, turned her back on the camera to do so, she was penealized for it, BUT the hunks sitting nearby, their chests showing and not penelized. so sexist? or what? I didn’t mean to get off the subject but caught this on the news and thought I would share. wasn’t a shower scene, but…
The funniest body scene I have seen in a men’s bathhouse where a female worker goes to the boss!
Checkout Ms Temper and Nam Jung Gi, close to the end of episode 3. This drama is so underrated but so hilarious and also food for the thought regarding women in the working world.
https://www.viki.com/videos/1099147v-ms-temper-nam-jung-gi-episode-3
I have been wanting to watch that one!
haha, you’re my party animal:)))
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You do know that Adam and Eve are a fairytale right? Otherwise to build more humans, Cain or Abel would have had to have an incestuous relationship with their mother. So, bringing that story into the discussion, really doesn’t have much relevance.
[quote=“adrianmorales, post:1, topic:20324”]
I was a male, apparently, and I couldn’t say anything. Again, this is total BS. No, I’m not a guy or woman or anything.
[/quote] Then are you a robot? I’m missing something here.
And, I’m sorry, but I don’t get what the big deal here is? You see less in a shower scene in a Korean drama than you would at the beach. (Or sometimes at your local Walmart!!) Usually, these guys are not babies…but grown men who work hard at and are proud of their healthy bodies, unlike the underage female idols and trainees forced to wear hotpants and short skirts and wear a size -10. Double standard? More like multiple-standards…always will be as long as there are humans and sex.
[quote=“joongkijunkie, post:28, topic:20324, full:true”]
See it in context. What Adrian means, I think, is that people shouldn’t make distinctions of gender when someone is bullied. When males bully females it’s a big deal, but in school he was a male bullied by females and it wasn’t taken seriously, so nobody did anything about it.
(Of course he might also mean he (they?) is non-binary, not identifying with either male or female gender. This is a thing today, apparently.)
About shower scenes. I’m not concerned/shocked or whatever by what we actually see in a shower scene. And of course, as you rightly say, one can see much more at the beach - men and women alike.
It is the objectifying of men. It is the fact that these shower scenes are 100% of the times totally unneeded and unrelated to the plot, their ONLY reason of existence is to make female and gay audiences drool. In that sense, it is a use of men as a sex object. This is what I don’t like.
And I don’t agree that Korean entertainment industry does not have harsh expectations from the men too. Most of them are too skinny, too (look at their legs), because
- they are supposed to have a sharp jawline, but the natural Korean face is rather round, so to achieve this they have to be underweight.
- they have to conform to the manga male ideal, imported to Korean manwha too, of the man who is super tall and super thin, like a lamp post.
So actors are selected for their height and then made to diet until they are stick-thin and with their jaw bones showing prominently.
Have you seen the comments by (female/gay) viewers? “Oooh, look at his jaw, he could cut bread with it”. Or, when the female is short “Look at the height gap, so precious!”
Because, strangely enough, the woman being short is not a problem. It is viewed as cute.
On the other hand, men are ALSO supposed to be buffed, so they work out like mad, so that they have mostly muscles with very low body fat percentage. All this while filming with crazy schedules, modeling, shooting advertisements and appearing to functions, giving interviews (if they are famous) and keeping track of their social media accounts.
I wouldn’t say they have it easy either.
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If you’re lazy to read this answer, just skip it 
In 1 sentence: we believe what we want to believe. (Ideas, opinions, religion)
2nd, we pick the way we write. We’re responsible of what we write, anonymously behind a confortable alias or bare. Our writting reflects who we are, our mood, our opinion.
If I remember it correctly (sorry, didn’t read the whole post a second time):
Sum up why Adam & Eve:
Naked torsos => nudity => modesty and also God (it was evoked here by another participant that’s why I answered with Adam and Eve to be on the same “la” since we came to talking about religion).
So 3 things in your answer (the way I read it
-
why religion in this topic?
-
truth(s) about Adam and Eve
-
incest in religion => moral?
-
why religion in this topic?
Just in case, I’m not an Evangelist or a converter or a scientist about our origins or I don’t know who. We believe or we don’t believe, there’s no coercition in faith. So each one is free.
I have friends and family who believe and some no. I think for everyone, it’s the same.
My religion or lack of religion doesn’t matter here.
=> In general, I don’t like to take/use religion or God as an argument when talking with a friend or family member for various reasons. So if you meant what’s the point of using religion here, I totally agree with what’s the point of using religion as an explanation to how we should be in society, knowing that there are believers and non believers (one of the various reasons).
Some conversations look roughly like that:
“Oh, but God “said” that…”
“I’m atheist.”
“The Science “said” that…”
“I’m capitalist.”
(Are they other religions?)
Which one represents the actors or the production companies?
That’s why comes the “Apart from religion…” (cf the Adam and Eve post).
=> I understand that religion exists and we can’t neglect its impact in our society, believers or not.
Moral, modesty and religion in our modern society.
So yes, I understand why a participant thought of it here. Of course and it’s normal!
To answer it, making reference to God makes me give a reference about nudity and modesty in the Bible (see post about God, it was the answer to this post). We can interpret biblical verses as we want. A Christian who believes in Adam and Eve, from the Bible, read that we weren't born with clothes or shame of being naked. No notion of shame, bareness. So refering to God for shame or bareness, it's not really what it's written in the Genesa. That was the point.
Someone who thinks that it’s a fairytale, then nakeness and shame comes from somewhere else.
It depends on what you want to believe.
- Adam and Eve, the Bible: truth or fairytale? Each one has a way to live his/her religion or his absence of religion. Each one follows some principles (biblical or not), believes some parts of the Bible or not.
Jewish don’t believe in the New Testament.
Some Christians don’t believe in The Genesa (world’s creation by God and Adam & Eve story) but belive in God.
We (Humans race and each one individually) interpret what the Bible says or people who wrote the Bible. An interpretation. Another ex apart from Adam and Eve: I don’t think the Bible forbade expressly Catholic priests to marry but the way it’s written, we can interpet that it is fine or it is forbidden.
Origins:
We weren’t there and more we go back in time, more it’s difficult to know how it was when everything began.
We have science.
Even scientists don’t agree on the origins (Big Bang, and disagree with theories and theories, making assumptions to advance). Some new theories contradict old theories, scientists interpret their results differently. You have schools that preach this theory, and others another one.
Adam and Eve, can we see it as another theory among many others?
After life? Some say they see a tunnel (science has theories), others will go in Hell or Heaven. We don’t know.
Our theories, human interpretation, human science and hypothesis that I read and heard of:
-
perfect genes before and when you see how old they lived and how many children they had. Adam and Eve’s period = same natural rules, bodies, cells & genes as nowadays? Was it the same in Heaven and on Earth?
-
what the Bible doesn’t say doesn’t mean it didn’t happen: Adam and Eve had children after Caïn and Abel (which is written). There’s no specific date when Caïn killed Abel and when Adam and Eve had other children. One of the theories is: Caïn married his sister or his niece etc. Look for Awan, wife of Caïn.
-
incest: The Bible talks about incest which wasn’t forbidden until a certain period. And some believe that God created only 1 man and 1 woman not to have someone superior to someone. I don’t know why it was forbidden after this period of time.
Now, between noblesse, there was incest (believers). Nowadays, cousins, stepbrother/stepsister: does that mean they have no morals?
Except for the genetics and religion, why is incest forbidden in our society? Incest, love, human moral, religion? Our invention, interpretation, answer to what science can’t explain or real? -
the whole Bible is a fairytale: Adam and Eve, resurrection, Savior, last jugement…
-
metaphore of Adam / Eve: cells
-
Moral: mix between our own moral/society moral/ our interpretation of the Bible moral: hear a priest of the same passage of the Bible, you see different interpretations.
=>
My pov (not everyone’s pov):
I don’t have the answer, I’m not a god.
It’s you (yourself) and religion. It’s something we have to see with ourself. We believe or we don’t believe. That’s the principle of faith.
About religion, there’s no defenitive answer or universal answer of universal truth. Each one has a lead and follows his own truth, each one believes what he wants to believe. You have scientists who believe in God. Maths is a hard science, I don’t think religion is a hard science.
I was raised in a Cartesian way (school, job, my society). For me, science looks for one objective truth, logic answers to facts, events. But religion is not a matter of logic.
I’ve never thought of the Bible as a scientific book. And I don’t think Science can explain everything or explain the Bible. There are things that go out of the logic circuit. So when you have illogic events, facts or stories, science will find a way to find a logic answer. What happens when scientists don’t find a definitive answer?
There are some things that science didn’t manage to explain. Some people say it’s just coincidence, others say it’s a matter of time before science breaks the secret, others say it’s a miracle (religious miracle or no). I don’t denigrate science, but we are humans. Our mind needs to find a reason.
Without an answer that will suit us, we will continue to look.
You found your own answer for Adam and Eve.
Note:
It seems out of topic but your questions point that out for me. More than just the title, what makes a conversation interesting and natural is our way to go out of the mould of a title because each sentence echoes to someone else’s mind. I think that’s one way to develop our mind, exchange and that’s what makes big discoveries.
Don’t restrict your mind in a strict consign or in a square and be ready to hear all opinions, contrary or not. => It’s in that state of mind that I answered you, not for another reason.
Thanks for your post!
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Lee Joon Gi, worrisomely thin, borderline anorexic at this point, doubtfully his own choice 
I just want to feed him. All the time.
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