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Learning Korean :)


#83

how do you learn hangul without knowing how to pronounce the alphabet? :thinking: the question is a little unclearโ€ฆ


#84

:joy: After going through the alphabet, in order to learn sentences and new words, do beginners learn the hangul + the definition written down or do they also add the phonetic?


#85

At first most of us do, especially for pronounciation which does NOT follow the rules. After a couple of months, itโ€™s only necessary in rare cases.
We learners of Korean would be the happiest people on earth if the pronounciation rules of Hangul were followed by modern Korean speakers. But most characters are not pronounced as we first learned them.

Changes at the beginning and end
For instance, you learn that a character is pronounced G and a character is pronounced B. And you feel happy and secure, โ€œoh Hangul is easy, I already know theseโ€.
However, shortly after, youโ€™re told that they are pronounced G and B only inside a word, while at the beginning or end they are really pronounced a soft K and P. Which are not as forceful as the regular K and P. I can tell you that after a year of lessons and five years of dramas, I still canโ€™t distinguish them when somebody speaks. (For Indians it should be easier, since they also have this difference between โ€œpโ€ and P (hhhh!) etc.).
Thereโ€™s more. The G that became K turns back to G if you add a suffix starting from a vowel, and thus is not end anymore, but inside the letter. Or in compounds. Therefore the same word or verb is pronounced differently, according to what comes after it!

Weird batchim rules
Thereโ€™s more. There is a group of consonants (D, S, J, TCH, T, H) that when they are at the end of the word and the next one starts with consonant, are ALL pronounced as T.
How logical is that?
If the consonants at the end of the word are two, then only one is pronounced. The rule being that itโ€™s โ€œthe one thatโ€™s first in the alphabetโ€. But this rule is not always valid.
Again, if the next word starts with vowel, the original pronounciation comes back.

Stuffed nose pronounciation
Thereโ€™s more. You realize, with great surprise and dismay, that when you always heard in dramas โ€œDeโ€ (meaning โ€œyesโ€), in reality itโ€™s written โ€œNeโ€. And โ€œdampionโ€ (husband) is written โ€œnampionโ€. What? What you hear as โ€œBian-heโ€ (โ€œIโ€™m sorryโ€), in reality is โ€œMian-heโ€. Then you ask your Korean teacher: โ€œWhy do you pronounce N as D and M as B, as if you had a stuffed nose because of a cold?โ€
And the Korean โ€œteacherโ€ replies: โ€œWhat are you talking about? The two sounds you just made are the sameโ€.
โ€œNo, no, wait. One is bianhe and the other mianheโ€.
โ€œYes, exactly, they are the sameโ€.
Then you sigh and stop the conversation. They really canโ€™t hear itโ€™s a totally different sound? Moreover, in dramas, older characters, or when speaking more formally, pronounce โ€œNeโ€ (as itโ€™s written) and not โ€œDeโ€. So is one way more formal and the other more โ€œsloppyโ€? The clueless, gawking, fumbling and irritatingly dumb female leads, for instance, all say โ€œdeโ€. Invariably. The male lead, if heโ€™s a CEO or a lawyer, may say โ€œneโ€ at times.


#86

Do you want to discourage people from learning Korean? :rofl:
Thank you for all this! Maybe we can learn that the โ€œwordโ€ is pronounced and written like that, which I found difficult for adult foreigners!
Your conversations with your teacher sound really funny!


#87

In this, itโ€™s no worse than English. At least Korean is consistent. English pronounciation doesnโ€™t follow any kind of logic.
Think of draught, gauge and Gloucestershire or even breakfast, leisure (lehjur in English and leejur in American)


#88

After using Learn Mode this stuff had become way less confusingโ€ฆbecause I can see the spelling along with the pronunciation, it gets a lot easier.
I also read somewhere that this:

is because they like speaking fast and for the โ€˜sโ€™ sound you have to let out a little air. So they just donโ€™t let the air out and end the word so it usually sounds like โ€˜thโ€™. After I heard that, I understood the logic and went along with it :joy:


#89

:rofl: Batchim is why I have trouble spelling in Korean. I can read it ok for the most part as long as it is not fancy script but spelling is a chore because of batchim. Iโ€™ll figure it out eventually.

rough - ruff
though - tho
bough - bow
bought - bot
etc.

And donโ€™t even ask me how to pronounce worcestershire sauce. We just say Wikisheer. :rofl:


#90

Here you go. Learn Hangul!

Drag each letter over or down into their intersecting squares to combine them into something pronounceable. Then click on it to hear the sound.

Courtesy of Coursera, Younsei University, Seoul.

http://mooc.yonsei.ac.kr/ksh/


#91

aaaawww yโ€™all quit knocking the english language, but of course yโ€™all are right. there their, there, theyโ€™re. and so on. wor chester shire sauce well anyway thats how I say it.


#92

Bonjour Piranna,

Commence par apprendre le Hangeul ( alphabet corรฉen)๋‚˜๋Š” ํ•œ๊ธ€์„ ๋ฐฐ์šฐ๊ณ ์žˆ๋‹ค en commenรงant par les voyelles simples A - Ya -eo - yeo โ€ฆ ensuite les consonnes simples puis les doublesโ€ฆ la romanisation ( ๋‚˜๋Š” = naneun) peut aider au dรฉbut pour la prononciation mais mieux vaut ne pas lโ€™utiliser trop longtemps.
Le mieux est de prendre des cours (ex: korean dreams , Kaja corรฉe- sur youTube ou autres) et une appli ( ex: Hello Talk - Korean conversationโ€ฆ) mais lโ€™idรฉal serait de tโ€™inscrire ร  de vrais cours de corรฉen avec profs et รฉlรจves, on apprends bien plus vite en pratiquant.


#93

์•ˆ๋…•ํ•˜์„ธ์š”,

์ €๋Š” ๋ฒจ๊ธฐ์— ์ธ์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค


#94

์•ˆ๋…•ํ•˜์„ธ์š”! ๋‚˜๋Š” ๋ฏธ๊ตญ ์ถœ์‹ ์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค


#95

@porkypine90_261 ์•ˆ๋…•ํ•˜์„ธ์š”! ๋ฏธ๊ตญ์€ ์–ด๋•Œ์š”? ์ € ๊ฐ€๋ณธ ์ ์ด ์—†์–ด์„œ ๊ถ๊ธˆํ•ด์š” :slight_smile:


#96

์•ˆ๋…•ํ•˜์„ธ์š”! ๋ฏธ๊ตญ์€ ๊ฑฐ๋Œ€ํ•ด์š”!! ์šฐ๋ฆฌ๋Š” ์‚ฌ๋ง‰, ์‚ฐ, ๋Œ€์ดˆ์›, ์ˆฒ, ์•ŒํŒŒ์ธ, ๋Šช, ๋ถ๊ทน, ์—ด๋ ฌํ•œ ํฐ ๋„์‹œ, ์ž‘์€ ๋งˆ์„ ๊ธฐํ›„ ์žˆ์—์š”. ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์€ ์„ธ๊ณ„์ฃผ์œ„์—์„œ ์—ฌ๊ธฐ๋ฅผ ๋ผ์ด๋ธŒํ•ด์š”.

My grammar isnโ€™t that great yet. Itโ€™s supposed to mean - Hello. America is huge! We have deserts, mountains, prairies, forests, alpine, swamp, arctic, tropical, big cities, small towns. etc. People from around the world live here. :smile:

My understanding of Korean is much higher than my ability to compose sentences. :grin: Iโ€™ve only been learning for a year and since Iโ€™m self taught, my learning is haphazard. I need to work on grammar.


#97

Your Korean is excellent for having self taught for just a year.
Iโ€™ve made few changes to your Korean translation.

์•ˆ๋…•ํ•˜์„ธ์š”. ๋ฏธ๊ตญ์€ ์•„์ฃผ ๊ฑฐ๋Œ€ํ•ด์š”! ์—ฌ๊ธฐ๋Š” ์‚ฌ๋ง‰, ์‚ฐ, ์ดˆ์›, ์ˆฒ, ์‚ฐ์•…์ง€๋Œ€, ๋Šช, ๋ถ๊ทน์ง€๋Œ€, ์—ด๋Œ€์ง€์—ญ, ๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ณ  ๋Œ€๋„์‹œ์™€ ์ž‘์€๋งˆ์„๊นŒ์ง€ ๋‹ค ์žˆ์–ด์š”. ์ „์„ธ๊ณ„ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์ด ์—ฌ๊ธฐ ์‚ด์•„์š”.

Note: Alpine means โ€œof the mountainโ€ and youโ€™ve already listed ์‚ฐ (mountain), so I just used the word for โ€œmountain rangeโ€ instead.


#98

์—ฌ๊ธฐ ํ•œ๊ตญ์–ด์œผ๋กœ ์ดํ•ด๊ธฐ ํ•ฉ์‹œ๋‹ค! ๋‚˜๋„ ์ผ ๋…„์—๊ฒŒ ํ•œ๊ตญ๋ง ๋ฐฐ์šฐ๊ณ  ์žˆ์–ด์š”โ€ฆ
please do correct me if Im wrong, Iโ€™d love to learn like this! whoops I just noticed Iโ€™m TERRIBLE at formality levels :flushed: I started with the highest, that ๋‚˜๋„ should be jodo, and I ended at semi-formal what on earth I need more practice!! (Iโ€™ve logged in on another device so I donโ€™t have my hangul keyboard )


#99

@vivi_1485, just a few corrections. โ€œํ•œ๊ตญ์–ด๋กœ ์ด์•ผ๊ธฐ ํ•ฉ์‹œ๋‹ค.โ€ Can you clarify your second sentence? Were you trying to say that you have been learning Korean for one year?

Btw, maybe itโ€™s a good idea to start a separate thread?:thinking:


#100

๋ฏธ๊ตญ์— ๋Œ€ํ•ด ์ด๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ์—ด์ •ํ•˜๊ฒŒ ๋งํ•˜๋Š” ๊ฑธ ๋ณด๋Š”๊ฒŒ ์ •๋ง ์žฌ๋ฐŒ๋„ค์š”. ์—ฌ๊ธฐ ๋„ค๋œ๋ž€๋“œ์—์„œ ์‚ฐ๋„, ๋Šช๋„, ์ดˆ์›๋„, ๋ถ๊ทน์ง€๋Œ€๋„ ๋‹ค ์—†์ง€๋งŒ ์ˆฒ๊ณผ ๋ฐ”๋‹ค๋Š” ์žˆ์–ด์š”. NL์€ ์ž‘์•„์„œ ์ œ์ผ ํฐ ๋„์‹œ์— ์‚ฌ๋žŒ 80๋งŒ ๋ช… ๋ฐ–์— ์•ˆ ์‚ด์•„์š”. ๊ทธ๊ฑฐ ๋ฏธ๊ตญ๋„์‹œ ๋น„๊ฒฐํ•˜๋ฉด ์šฐ๋ฆฌ ์ œ์ผ ํฐ ๋„์‹œ๋Š” ๋Œ€๋„์‹œ ์•„๋‹ˆ๋ผ ์†Œ๋„์‹œ์—์š”.

์•„, ํ•œ๊ตญ์–ด๋กœ ์“ฐ๋Š” ๊ฑธ ์ƒ๊ฐ๋ณด๋‹ค ์–ด๋ ต๋„ค์š”. ์˜์–ด๋กœ ์“ฐ๋ฉด ์ž์‹  ์žˆ๋Š”๋ฐ ์–ด๋–ค ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์ด ๋ฉ”์„ธ์ง€ ๋์—์„œ Sorry for bad English ์™œ ์“ฐ๋Š”์ง€ ์ด์ œ ์ดํ•ด๋ผ์š”. ํ•œ๊ตญ์–ด๋กœ ์‹ค์ˆ˜ํ–ˆ๋‹ค๋ฉด Sorry for bad Korean ์ด์—์š”


#101

Iโ€™m pretty sure what you want to say is โ€œ๋‚˜๋„ ํ•œ๊ตญ๋ง ์ผ๋…„์ •๋„ ๋ฐฐ์šฐ๊ณ  ์žˆ์–ด์š”.โ€ (Iโ€™ve also been studying Korean for about a year.)


#102

In case you wanted corrections:

๋ฏธ๊ตญ์— ๋Œ€ํ•ด ์ด๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ์—ด์ •์ ์œผ๋กœ ์–˜๊ธฐํ•˜๋Š”๊ฑธ๋ณด๋‹ˆ ์žฌ๋ฏธ์žˆ๋„ค์š”. ์—ฌ๊ธฐ ๋„ค๋œ๋ž€๋“œ์—๋Š” ์‚ฐ๋„, ๋Šช๋„, ์ดˆ์›๋„, ๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ณ  ๋ถ๊ทน์ง€๋Œ€๋„ ์—†์ง€๋งŒ ์ˆฒ๊ณผ ๋ฐ”๋‹ค๋Š” ์žˆ์–ด์š”.

๋ฏธ๊ตญ์— ๋น„ํ•˜๋ฉด ์šฐ๋ฆฌ๋‚˜๋ผ์˜ ์ œ์ผ ํฐ๋„์‹œ๋Š” ๋Œ€๋„์‹œ๊ฐ€ ์•„๋‹ˆ๋ผ ์†Œ๋„์‹œ์˜ˆ์š”.

์•„, ํ•œ๊ตญ์–ด๋กœ ์“ฐ๋Š”๊ฒƒ ์ƒ๊ฐ๋ณด๋‹ค ์–ด๋ ต๋„ค์š”.

์˜์–ด๋กœ ์“ฐ๋ฉด ์ž์‹ ์žˆ๋Š”๋ฐ ์™œ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์ด ๋ฉ”์„ธ์ง€๋์— Sorry for bad English ์“ฐ๋Š”์ง€ ์ด์ œ ์ดํ•ด๊ฐ€๋ผ์š”.