Learning Korean :)

[piranna]

After going through the alphabet, in order to learn sentences and new words, do beginners learn the hangul + the definition written down or do they also add the phonetic?

[irmar]

After going through the alphabet, in order to learn sentences and new words, do beginners learn the hangul + the definition written down or do they also add the phonetic?

At first most of us do, especially for pronounciation which does NOT follow the rules. After a couple of months, it’s only necessary in rare cases.
We learners of Korean would be the happiest people on earth if the pronounciation rules of Hangul were followed by modern Korean speakers. But most characters are not pronounced as we first learned them.

Changes at the beginning and end
For instance, you learn that a character is pronounced G and a character is pronounced B. And you feel happy and secure, “oh Hangul is easy, I already know these”.
However, shortly after, you’re told that they are pronounced G and B only inside a word, while at the beginning or end they are really pronounced a soft K and P. Which are not as forceful as the regular K and P. I can tell you that after a year of lessons and five years of dramas, I still can’t distinguish them when somebody speaks. (For Indians it should be easier, since they also have this difference between “p” and P (hhhh!) etc.).
There’s more. The G that became K turns back to G if you add a suffix starting from a vowel, and thus is not end anymore, but inside the letter. Or in compounds. Therefore the same word or verb is pronounced differently, according to what comes after it!

Weird batchim rules
There’s more. There is a group of consonants (D, S, J, TCH, T, H) that when they are at the end of the word and the next one starts with consonant, are ALL pronounced as T.
How logical is that?
If the consonants at the end of the word are two, then only one is pronounced. The rule being that it’s “the one that’s first in the alphabet”. But this rule is not always valid.
Again, if the next word starts with vowel, the original pronounciation comes back.

Stuffed nose pronounciation
There’s more. You realize, with great surprise and dismay, that when you always heard in dramas “De” (meaning “yes”), in reality it’s written “Ne”. And “dampion” (husband) is written “nampion”. What? What you hear as “Bian-he” (“I’m sorry”), in reality is “Mian-he”. Then you ask your Korean teacher: “Why do you pronounce N as D and M as B, as if you had a stuffed nose because of a cold?”
And the Korean “teacher” replies: “What are you talking about? The two sounds you just made are the same”.
“No, no, wait. One is bianhe and the other mianhe”.
“Yes, exactly, they are the same”.
Then you sigh and stop the conversation. They really can’t hear it’s a totally different sound? Moreover, in dramas, older characters, or when speaking more formally, pronounce “Ne” (as it’s written) and not “De”. So is one way more formal and the other more “sloppy”? The clueless, gawking, fumbling and irritatingly dumb female leads, for instance, all say “de”. Invariably. The male lead, if he’s a CEO or a lawyer, may say “ne” at times.

[piranna]

We learners of Korean would be the happiest people on earth if the pronounciation rules of Hangul were followed by modern Korean speakers. But most characters are not pronounced as we first learned them.

Do you want to discourage people from learning Korean?
Thank you for all this! Maybe we can learn that the “word” is pronounced and written like that, which I found difficult for adult foreigners!
Your conversations with your teacher sound really funny!

[irmar]

Do you want to discourage people from learning Korean?

In this, it’s no worse than English. At least Korean is consistent. English pronounciation doesn’t follow any kind of logic.
Think of draught, gauge and Gloucestershire or even breakfast, leisure (lehjur in English and leejur in American)

[vivi_1485]

After using Learn Mode this stuff had become way less confusing…because I can see the spelling along with the pronunciation, it gets a lot easier.
I also read somewhere that this:

There is a group of consonants (D, S, J, TCH, T, H) that when they are at the end of the word and the next one starts with consonant, are ALL pronounced as T.

is because they like speaking fast and for the ‘s’ sound you have to let out a little air. So they just don’t let the air out and end the word so it usually sounds like ‘th’. After I heard that, I understood the logic and went along with it

[porkypine]

Weird batchim rules

Batchim is why I have trouble spelling in Korean. I can read it ok for the most part as long as it is not fancy script but spelling is a chore because of batchim. I’ll figure it out eventually.

English pronounciation doesn’t follow any kind of logic.

rough - ruff
though - tho
bough - bow
bought - bot
etc.

And don’t even ask me how to pronounce worcestershire sauce. We just say Wikisheer.

[porkypine]

Here you go. Learn Hangul!

Drag each letter over or down into their intersecting squares to combine them into something pronounceable. Then click on it to hear the sound.

Courtesy of Coursera, Younsei University, Seoul.

http://mooc.yonsei.ac.kr/ksh/

[frustratedwriter]

aaaawww y’all quit knocking the english language, but of course y’all are right. there their, there, they’re. and so on. wor chester shire sauce well anyway thats how I say it.

[ch_deco99_941]

Bonjour Piranna,

Commence par apprendre le Hangeul ( alphabet coréen)나는 한글을 배우고있다 en commençant par les voyelles simples A - Ya -eo - yeo … ensuite les consonnes simples puis les doubles… la romanisation ( 나는 = naneun) peut aider au début pour la prononciation mais mieux vaut ne pas l’utiliser trop longtemps.
Le mieux est de prendre des cours (ex: korean dreams , Kaja corée- sur youTube ou autres) et une appli ( ex: Hello Talk - Korean conversation…) mais l’idéal serait de t’inscrire à de vrais cours de coréen avec profs et élèves, on apprends bien plus vite en pratiquant.

[ch_deco99_941]

안녕하세요,

저는 벨기에 인입니다

[porkypine]

안녕하세요! 나는 미국 출신입니다

[oriya]

@porkypine90_261 안녕하세요! 미국은 어때요? 저 가본 적이 없어서 궁금해요

[porkypine]

미국은 어때요? 저 가본 적이 없어서 궁금해요

안녕하세요! 미국은 거대해요!! 우리는 사막, 산, 대초원, 숲, 알파인, 늪, 북극, 열렬한 큰 도시, 작은 마을 기후 있에요. 사람들은 세계주위에서 여기를 라이브해요.

My grammar isn’t that great yet. It’s supposed to mean - Hello. America is huge! We have deserts, mountains, prairies, forests, alpine, swamp, arctic, tropical, big cities, small towns. etc. People from around the world live here.

My understanding of Korean is much higher than my ability to compose sentences. I’ve only been learning for a year and since I’m self taught, my learning is haphazard. I need to work on grammar.

[ajumma2]

Your Korean is excellent for having self taught for just a year.
I’ve made few changes to your Korean translation.

Hello. America is huge! We have deserts, mountains, prairies, forests, alpine, swamp, arctic, tropical, big cities, small towns. etc. People from around the world live here.

안녕하세요. 미국은 아주 거대해요! 여기는 사막, 산, 초원, 숲, 산악지대, 늪, 북극지대, 열대지역, 그리고 대도시와 작은마을까지 다 있어요. 전세계 사람들이 여기 살아요.

Note: Alpine means “of the mountain” and you’ve already listed 산 (mountain), so I just used the word for “mountain range” instead.

[vivi_1485]

여기 한국어으로 이해기 합시다! 나도 일 년에게 한국말 배우고 있어요…
please do correct me if Im wrong, I’d love to learn like this! whoops I just noticed I’m TERRIBLE at formality levels I started with the highest, that 나도 should be jodo, and I ended at semi-formal what on earth I need more practice!! (I’ve logged in on another device so I don’t have my hangul keyboard )

[choitrio]

@vivi_1485, just a few corrections. “한국어로 이야기 합시다.” Can you clarify your second sentence? Were you trying to say that you have been learning Korean for one year?

Btw, maybe it’s a good idea to start a separate thread?

[oriya]

미국에 대해 이렇게 열정하게 말하는 걸 보는게 정말 재밌네요. 여기 네덜란드에서 산도, 늪도, 초원도, 북극지대도 다 없지만 숲과 바다는 있어요. NL은 작아서 제일 큰 도시에 사람 80만 명 밖에 안 살아요. 그거 미국도시 비결하면 우리 제일 큰 도시는 대도시 아니라 소도시에요.

아, 한국어로 쓰는 걸 생각보다 어렵네요. 영어로 쓰면 자신 있는데 어떤 사람들이 메세지 끝에서 Sorry for bad English 왜 쓰는지 이제 이해돼요. 한국어로 실수했다면 Sorry for bad Korean 이에요

[ajumma2]

나도 일 년에게 한국말 배우고 있어요…

I’m pretty sure what you want to say is “나도 한국말 일년정도 배우고 있어요.” (I’ve also been studying Korean for about a year.)

[ajumma2]

In case you wanted corrections:

미국에 대해 이렇게 열정하게 말하는 걸 보는게 정말 재밌네요. 여기 네덜란드에서 산도, 늪도, 초원도, 북극지대도 다 없지만 숲과 바다는 있어요.

미국에 대해 이렇게 열정적으로 얘기하는걸보니 재미있네요. 여기 네덜란드에는 산도, 늪도, 초원도, 그리고 북극지대도 없지만 숲과 바다는 있어요.

그거 미국도시 비결하면 우리 제일 큰 도시는 대도시 아니라 소도시에요.

미국에 비하면 우리나라의 제일 큰도시는 대도시가 아니라 소도시예요.

아, 한국어로 쓰는 걸 생각보다 어렵네요.

아, 한국어로 쓰는것 생각보다 어렵네요.

영어로 쓰면 자신 있는데 어떤 사람들이 메세지 끝에서 Sorry for bad English 왜 쓰는지 이제 이해돼요.

영어로 쓰면 자신있는데 왜 사람들이 메세지끝에 Sorry for bad English 쓰는지 이제 이해가돼요.

[choitrio]

@ajumma2, 되요 vs 돼요 is very confusing, but wouldn’t 이해가 돼요 be correct here?