I see, thanks!
Sorry, I won’t participate.
Thanks for clarifying what kind of session it is
(thanks to piranna for asking about the details).
Since the auto-translated subs feature is nothing that makes the work flow of volunteers easier (not mentioning that’s even nothing we as volunteers wanted or anything that offers any additional advance/use for us) I won’t participate.
1 Like
Being honest, I don’t really like this idea.
• Portuguese language isn’t difficult, but there’s a LOT of grammatic rules that even native speakers have difficult to understand. A bot/AI translation would make it very poor and horrible to read.
• We can’t directly translate eng-port, we always need to adapt the context to portuguese because it sounds strange. Mainly in chineses dramas, when the english subtitle is like a seven words phrase and it becomes a thirteen words phrase that you can’t understand or doesn’t even have time to read. We always need to read, understand the context, watch some parts to see what’s happening and rewrite everything in a “normal” way. We aren’t just translators, we are interpreters. A bot/AI can’t do this.
• Even if it’s made a enormous banner saying with all the letters that the episode is auto subbed, mostly users wouldn’t read and would complain about the poor translation. Instead of rating the shows low for the slow translation, they would rate low for the poor translation.
• I truly believe that PT subbers are the fastest. In half a hour after the “GO”, every episode part is already being translated, mainly if it’s a popular Korean show. The greatest delay is from the english team.
I think that people will complain about everything we do, sometimes they just want to complain about anything. Solving it like this won’t solve the problem, instead, it would create even more problems. They would watch a automated subs episode, complain about it and go to other sites to watch the show with better quality subs.
I think of two solutions for this problem:
1 - Solving the english team problems. They’re complaining about regional access for years, and that’s the root of the problem. If the english team is faster, the other teams will also be faster. We all need the english team. Without them, there wouldn’t be any other language subs.
2 - Releasing the episode after everything is done. After the english team is done, the viewers are able to watch. Or the episode could be delayed for 4-6 days, being aired after most languages are done.
As volunteers, we spend hours, effort and attention. We always work hard to give the viewers the best watching experience. Please don’t create another vikibot, explain the translation process to non-volunteers. _ Please choose quality over speed.
Please listen to us_. Listen to the english team that always request something important. Listen to all volunteers that dedicate their own time to “work” here. We all are a team, the vikistaff and volunteers, and we need to listen to each other. We just want the best to Viki.
8 Likes
I honestly thought this was a really good idea…it would totally lower the amount of sub-whiners and ppl who use the Reviews page to complain and give fake ratings because of the subs
The drama might come out late, but at least not as many people will be complaining.
But I just realized that for subbers to work on the episode, THEY need access to the episodes to be able to sub it so now idk 
3 Likes
Yes, and not only that. On Viki there are a lot of Koreans and Korean-Americans, Chinese and Chinese-American, or people from all over the world who know these languages, for whatever reason. How about them? They don’t need subtitles, so if the video is withheld to avoid sub-whiners, those poor people would also be obliged to wait with the rest of us. Which is not fair.
5 Likes
Yes! I think it’s a great idea! 
I think this is an horrible idea, I know you guys have good intentions but this will make things way worse.
Viki is a paid service, will people want a lower quality subtitling? Of course not. This is way too much, is actually disrespectful with us volunteers! We work hard to make an good translation and thats what we receive?
This said, I wish you guys think twice about it. The best option is dont make it.
4 Likes
I also wanted to add that I really hate the white background of all badges. IF you changed the page then please also “correct” the transparency of the badges. Thank you!
7 Likes
We hope to inform the community in advance before we roll out the 2nd phase.
Are we at Phase 2 now?
Spanish, Portuguese and French
I thought somehow there was an agreement about French bot subtitles.
@anna79_9, @gwadaelle
Well, that’s new viki style: Watch movies and series anywhere in the world with automatic captions, speed guaranteed!
There is no agreement, they do what they want, that’s all. They want to put their bot, let them put it! I don’t care anymore.
It is a risky investment. Bet on the bot, a tool that is not yet efficient enough. Fortunately, good pears of volunteers are there to pick up the broken pots!
Perhaps in 50 years, linguists and professionals around the world will have perfected this software. Google, what are you doing? Quickly, viki is betting everything on you, damn it!
But I guess it attracts some audience, since it works. Well… let’s see in the future ^^
(luckily there are some normal people who use the sane platforms like netflix or amazon prime)
I mean, I also use automatic checkout when I do shopping, but I can tell you, I am the worst cashier! 
6 Likes
If I remember correctly, it already had those damn bot subtitles, since 2019 or something, when it came to Viki.
Hello I’m having problems with the chatter, it used to show the new messages but now I need to roll down all the time to see the new messages.
Another thing I wanted to ask: if a Channel manager isn’t answering any message who sould I speak with? it’s been more than a month since I send a message and I’ve send another maybe two weeks ago, the spanish moderator left the team and we need a new one to start working.
2 Likes
Despite the detailed explanation of how automatic translations and algorithms will not supersede or interfere with the quality of subs coming out of the Viki community, I have to laugh at the automatic response to my wanting to post on this topic:
Revive this topic?
The last reply to this topic was 10 months ago . Your reply will bump the topic to the top of its list and notify anyone previously involved in the conversation.
Are you sure you want to continue this old conversation?
The answer is, “Of course!”
Ten months ago, when people in charge of political decisions all over the world were universally and uniformly handling COVID policies and procedures badly, when economies and families and hopes and dreams were being devastated every day, and when disdain and hatred for AAPI groups in my country was rampant, I barely had time to focus on the Viki Community I contribute to as a subber.
I had trouble keeping in touch with my family members 500 miles from my home; I was in tears from hearing the stories of “Asianese” friends who were ridiculed and threatened on a daily basis; I wept because bad COVID policies kept two dear non-Asian friends from getting medical help on a timely basis and contributed to their non-COVID deaths.
I personally was so stressed out last year from a combination of issues that my previously robust health declined rapidly and led to my spending two weeks in the hospital with COVID at the the start of 2022.
Do I want to revive a topic that has been near and dear to my heart since my joining Viki?
Making subbing easier for subbers, the people that I consider to be the heart of the Viki Community Team, is something I definitely want to revive! I always want to have it as a topic of discussion.
As I look around the “Viki-verse” (the Viki universe) right now, in the spring of 2022, I see that those who serve as liaisons between Viki and the decision-makers at Rakuten are still struggling as much as they were three years ago.
Viki is what some economic models would call a wholly owned subsidiary of Rakuten. It has the unenviable task of making sure Viki retains everything that makes it superior to Netflix as a platform for promoting and showing Korean television shows and movies. And this is because Viki will disappear just like DramaFever if it doesn’t provide Rakuten with a decent income stream.
I cannot imagine the pressure the most responsible members of the Viki Community must be under every single day to make sure the best source for Asian drama doesn’t disappear from the entertainment marketplace.
However, as someone university-trained in the mysteries of English literature of the past 1600 years, and as someone who has spent the past 35 years tutoring people in English as a second language, I keep having to shake my head when I look around the world of Viki.
Limiting projects that channel managers can work on is great. Providing automatic translations for dramas is great (even though I wonder what the difference would be between those and presubs).
However, when I look at a wide variety of dramas on Viki, the biggest problem I see is consistency in the application of already existing standards for subbing and segmenting.
Different channel managers apparently use or ignore those standards as they see fit. I was taught, for instance, that an off-screen monolog or an off-screen dialog should always be italicized. However, I am watching Master of My Own, a delightful show in all respects, and the formatting for dialog is much different. Off-screen monologs and dialogs are enclosed in parentheses.
Also, it is often hard to know if the particular choices of English translation in Master of My Own are the result of deliberate decisions to reflect the essence of Chinese culture and language . . . OR are they are auto-translations . . . OR are they typically bizarre and mysterious pre-subs that escaped someone’s notice . . . ???
Regarding the idea that there are too many dramas and too few segmenters and subbers to handle them . . . well, where is that Asian creativity and problem solving that gave the world writing, gunpowder, ancient medicine, some of the earliest forms of money, and some of the earliest forms of art and literature? Where is some brainstorming, some Google-style collaboration, some Apple-style ingenuity, some Samsung-style and LG-style and Kia-style precision and streamlining?
There will always be human beings who are unhappy, whether they are family members, neighbors, or strangers. That unhappiness in certain Viki subscribers/users comes from experiences that occurred long before they started watching Goblin or Devil Judge or Sh**ting Stars.
Their emotional trauma did not originate with Viki, nor is it Viki’s responsibility to function as their parent or therapist and give them the happiness they think someone owes them.
Viki’s job is to take care of Viki, to make it the best, simplest, most elegant, most representative venue for modern treasures of Asian culture that it can possibly be.
Viki’s job is to make sure the website works well, that the hardware and software and firmware and servers operating behind the scenes are up to date.
Viki’s job is to offer the best possible technical assistance to subbers and segmenters who freely and without any monetary compensation often spend twenty hours a week providing subtitling and segmenting.
Viki’s job is to help potential users and subscribers how Viki is distinctly different from Netflix and other websites and to ignite a passion for Viki-style entertainment.
That’s how Viki can really improve life for subbers and segmenters, subscribers and users, Viki paid employees and their managers, supervisors, directors, etc.
That’s MY feedback. That’s why I’m reviving this 10-month-old topic, and that’s why I will continue to talk about my particular view of how Viki can strive to truly be the “heart of of Asian entertainment.”
6 Likes
seriously, you are so right 
1 Like
You made very good points.
However, we’ve already talked about standardizing the standards. It just doesn’t work. We’re all different and have different perspectives, so we just have to follow along with the CE or CM. To standardize the standards, there will always be a group who is unhappy with the decision. We can hardly come to one decision when so many minds are at work here. As far as I’ve seen, most of the standards don’t really hurt anyone. Parentheses and italics probably aren’t going to inconvenience anyone much.
2 Likes
Also some of the pre-subbed English subs we get at viki insist on all capitalization of on screen text rather than simple italics.
1 Like
This is where cultural sensitivity and not stepping on toes meets the reality of the marketplace.
Netflix has subs that are consistent in format. Period. Korean and Chinese and Thai and every other Asian tv/movie network/platform produce shows that have an exceedingly high level of quality in every aspect BEFORE they get passed to Viki.
Graphic design, costumes, opening and closing credits, music, advertising . . . everything about those shows BEFORE they get entrusted to Viki is top-notch because those shows are modern cultural artifacts, expressions (at least in terms of what I watch) of the best aspects of different cultures.
And in theory, the various women (and men) who are involved in making them “Viki-available” through subbing and segmenting take great pride in sharing something that can give complete strangers a positive view of their cultures.
But from drama to drama, culture to culture, responsible person to responsible person . . . the impression is not good because there is no consistent, coherent, comprehensive application of basic standards that have been around for a long time. The standards are not a secret known only to the special few.
If Viki community members who are most senior and most experienced in subbing and segmenting all agree on the same formatting . . . if they all train junior and less experienced community members to do the same things the same way . . . if Viki employees focus on NOT letting themselves get scared by a vocal minority . . . if EVERYBODY (both paid and volunteer) works hard at collaboration and excelling individually . . . I don’t think there would be any problem producing great dramas with great subs.
As with many other things in this world, careful education according to high standards, modeling, mentoring, and honest communication back and forth would produce great results.
1 Like
This drama is coming with pre-subs, maybe you watched it before it has been edited.
3 Likes
I have been watching Master of My Own since it started on Viki. I have been watching purely as a subscriber, not as anyone who has access to the show’s presubs.
There are currently 24 episodes showing on the Viki website. Up to episode 22, the percentage of subbing in English for each episode is 100 percent with the exception of two (I think) being 99%. Episodes 23 and 24 have the caption underneath that reads, “Available in 1 day.”
Below are two examples of English subtitling that do not follow what I learned when I started working on pre-subs for the C-drama Be Together.
In episode 10 of Master of My Own at time stamp 08:43, the scene shows a computer monitor displaying some type of financial report. The English sub looks like this:
[Yuanyuan Real Estate Co., Ltd. Financial Report]
The English sub should look like this:
[Yuanyuan Real Estate Co., Ltd. Financial Report] (everything italicized)
In episode 11, at time stamp 02:46, the English sub looks like this:
[Change]Thanks.
The English sub should look like this:
[Change] (the title of the economics textbook Su Wei Ran is reading)
Thanks. (Ning Meng’s response to Su Wei Ran letting her read the book)
I worked on Be Together with @worthyromance as my teacher before she had health issues that forced her to stop subbing for quite a period of time. She stressed consistency and clear identification in English of different types of dialog and descriptions.
Then I worked on _The Prince Who Turned Into A Frog _ . I had a fascinating time discussing some fairly incomprehensible presubs with @addictedtobooks and several others, and the philosophy was: make things simple, make them make sense, and Follow. The. Guidelines.
In the past two years, I have fallen in love with C-dramas completely. At the start of 2021, I was was excited to learn that Yang Mi (whom I adored in The Legend of Fu Yao) was starring in a modern drama, Storm Eye, and it was, from my perspective, an almost perfect drama, both technically and creatively.
It said so much that is important about the value of home, family, the importance of cultivating beauty and virtue, and the importance of maturing from selfishness and thoughtless immaturity to unselfishness and sober, virtuous maturity. The opening theme and credits brought me to tears every time.
There is a sweetness and gentleness in C-dramas that I think many people ignore or misread because China seems to them to be so big, old, and mysterious. To me that is unfortunate, and I want people to be as in love with C-dramas as I am.
IMHO, the clearer and simpler and more standardized the English subs are, the easier it will be for people to appreciate both the subs and the dramas.
2 Likes
Pre-sub means that the episodes are coming with subtitles already. Everyone can see them. I am a segmenter on this show, the last time I saw they haven’t edited episode 10 yet.
4 Likes