Viki

[Viki Community] New Moderator Roles Requirements


#41

I don’t like the decision of yours.
The quality of the subtitles will increase a lot and many moderators will only do short dramas to work on. Why? Because they don’t want to be connected to just those 3 dramas.
Also, they will do the translation of the dramas faster, which sounds great at first, but when you think of it, you’ll realize that the subtitles will be less accurate and maybe, many of them will also be missed.
Of course, not every moderator will be like this, I mean, I hope so… But a lot of 'em.


#42

Not to forgot they’re bugged projects with segments past the end of the video… :no_mouth:


#43

In my experience, this would be a disaster for the NSSA Sandbox, especially with one of the bugs that some students were plagued with recently. We need to be able to add and remove students when necessary.

So I’m also curious to see if the Training Channels are included. Like @damiechan and @mirjam_465 mentioned, I don’t think they should be. Not that it matters for me personally at this moment, but it could be important for some of the other Sensei’s.


#44

Great news! Just an information, please?

I have 5 channel training with NSSA as english moderator (some all language), that doesn’t count, does it? Is it 5 channels in the same language? For some segmenters, it would be difficult because some need english moderator power to correct.

I guess for some situations, you will have to verify each singular situation. ^^ Need some regulation.

(Sorry I don’t read all the comments, the question may have already been asked)


#45

This is an oversimplified solution to a complex problem.

How is this new rule going to be enforced? Automatically or manually by CMs?

Will we have to continue spending our time checking other people’s projects? Or can Viki provide a tool for calculating the number of unfinished projects?

How are we to distinguish properly if a OL Mod is stuck in a project due to the English team being late?

Been saying this for ages now…

Last few months I’ve been trying to do just that. Guess what. Sometimes the CM refuses to remove you.

Edit: I can already hear the sound of existing Viki users opening fake secondary and tertiary accounts just to override this rule. (Yes, it’s a thing already.)


#46

The things people will do to do unpaid labour :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:
If they are doing this, then volunteering isn’t their hobby.


#47

I completely understand and agree as you said, not everyone will be like this. I personally think it’s better than giving the opportunity for hoarders to monopolize projects😭


#48

I’m so happy I’m not the only one who wanted to ask this question :smiley: Turns out I knew what it was, but it doesn’t show what it says it should… at least yet, so I was confused too.


#49

Okay…so although there seems to be a good intention here to stop hoarders from piling up all the possible projects, as my fellow volunteers suggested above, you seem to skip many important matters to come to a basic resolution, with or without feedback, won’t be changing much, if not making it worse.

Before expecting any feedback on these new requirements/rules is introduced, why not hear out the actual problems first? Increasing subtitle quality won’t be a thing just by limiting the number of projects one can moderate. Instead, Viki should have an active team to ACTUALLY check and reply to tickets related to real problems such as abusers who use google translate and such, CMs who are MIA.

Many of the volunteers here are people who devote their precious time, hours every day for years, for one simple purpose. Like in every community there are different views on many things, but what we all work on here is: making Asian content accessible to monolingual people in our languages. I’m fairly a new volunteer here and I must admit that I am shocked and a bit horrified to see how much volunteers work for this purpose, this volunteer community is literally one of a kind with how things progress, how there is an order created by volunteers that makes everything work smoothly and professionally, while Viki handles almost everything the most unprofessional way possible. I haven’t seen any subtitling community/streaming service with a team who works like this even when they get paid.

So even though you had a good intention here, please try starting with:

  • Taking tickets related to low-quality subtitles&GT abusers serious
  • Try to engage with the community more to hear different ideas from the people who devote their time here
  • When you enforce a “punishment” upon a user, clarify the reasons, and be more transparent with people who are involved in the progress so that other volunteers know the decision is just, instead of having a chaotic environment, assuming things, etc.
  • Pick a CM properly and at least a week prior to show airing so that people have enough time to pick a team of qualified members instead of being forced to pick whoever applies first.
  • Fix bugs that exist for years now…like…permanently.
  • Create a functional inbox… it is 2022
  • Bring a blocking function so that volunteers can block those who assault them verbally via inbox.

These are just a few I can think of in a short 5 mins.

We, as volunteers, do a pretty decent job I believe. I think increasing the quality would be possible only if Viki also works as diligently as we do. You literally can hire people for this job…I mean even in this community, I’m sure there are plenty of people who would be capable of the position/s. Please try to work along with volunteers instead of removing their presence here, not paying attention to suggestions and complaints, and discouraging us alltogether. It’s like a school project. I can get my part done quite perfectly but if you won’t do yours…we won’t get that A+ :upside_down_face:


#50

Completely agree with you on that. I have seen moderators with a bunch of projects and then the sad thing is that more than half of them are not even completed and have been sitting there without subs for a long while. Yet they keep getting new projects, and adding to the pile. It would also let more moderators, especially newer ones get projects because again it is the same people who have like 10 ongoing projects the ones getting all the mod positions.

In a way the thought process of this update is great but it does need modifications. As @anyelasspace said, limiting the number of projects a moderator can take won’t do anything if the other issues are not addressed. One of them being inactive channel managers. I have seen plenty of projects where the CM and (even the other language moderators) have not been active for a very long time. That leaves the show/series halfway done. A team should be actively checking that all channels are running smoothly and that the team members aren’t inactive.


#51

Some have already mentioned that some volunteers have more capacity and better team availability than others.

May I suggest that for every 200.000 subs a moderator makes, Viki increases the allowed quota of the projects. And they can do that by introducing additional QC tiers:

Gold QC 200 (contributed 200.000 subs in total) - could take up to 6 (7) language moderator roles
Gold QC 400 - could take up to 7 (9) language moderator roles
etc.


#52

I agree with you, Bozoli. Five is too little, there are many different circumstances to every project. Dimghro also stated them in this thread.


#53

I think that the number should only be seen as a guideline. There should rather be a check whether the released episodes are translated within a certain, fixed time. If there are delays, then the now programmed lock that moderators can not be added, should take effect.


#54

According to the article, Viki will do the implementation themselves. You won’t be allowed to add a user who already has 3/5 mod projects.


#55

I think this will work well only if the Viki staff are active in the Help Center and answer tickets fast enough. That way, they can help us with the loopholes. The staff will have to be very active to help move along slow projects or free moderators held hostage by inactive/insensitive CMs. Special eps, abandoned projects… all those loopholes will have to be taken care of efficiently. And please ANSWER ABUSER REPORTS ASAP.

I also think 3000 subs is way too low.

I agree. Gold QC needs 20000 subs, the next tier with 100000, and the next with 150000/200000

For the problem of English teams holding eps without releasing them to OL…
(I might be wrong here, feel free to disagree or point out where I’m wrong)

I recently wrapped up working on a project with 40 1-hour eps. It took us about 11 months, during which all the OLs were held up. In the stream of editor-TE-GE-CE, I think the most time is taken by the TE. Now, I’m not blaming the TEs at all. We have a very real shortage of good TEs, and that’s why TEs end up taking a lot of projects. Unpopular projects, like the one I mentioned above, usually take the back burner.

With this new rule, since everyone has less projects to work with, the projects may move faster.

However, this is the best-case scenario. It isn’t hard to just change the TE’s English Moderator role to Editor. I’m just worried that everyone is going to disregard the roles completely and appoint language mods as all language mods to get around the limit.

Also, this will cause huge delays. Especially right after the rule has been implemented, new project CMs may have a very hard time recruiting mods because everyone is tied up. They might have to end up working with less experienced newbies, who may not have been properly trained. As stated before, 3000 subs is too less to qualify.

Like someone else already mentioned, we might need a revamp of role definitions. Maybe new “Page Designer” and “Sensei” roles, so no one thinks Page Designers are abusers.


#56

Hi! I’m back with part two, given the joy some people have about these new requirements!

Update: I now have two projects that I don’t know when they will be released… Nice!

It seems that some people are thinking strictly about themselves or their community, and that’s why they are happy. Maybe in some communities there are no irresponsible people interested in becoming moderators at all anymore, or maybe more importantly, in some communities all the volunteers are amazing and provide impeccable quality, and also everyone collaborates with everyone without being selfish.

This time I will talk about the situation in my community and try to be as explicit as possible. There will probably be other communities that will find themselves in this situation.

When I decided to become a moderator, it was strictly because I wanted to give a helping hand to those who were already moderators and doing a great job. Over time, as I got to know the community better, I came to discover more and more people with serious quality issues. So I started looking for solutions. One of these, and the one that is the most blamed, was to apply to as many projects as I could, within my allotted Viki time. This way I thought I would limit the access of many people with problems to as many projects as possible. Given that my projects have always been translated with a deadline, with teams and have been edited, I saw no problem with my solution, as long as this solution limits access to those with problems. I also never stopped subbing, still translating for all moderated projects and other responsible moderators.

A second reason was the existence of moderators who translate alone and those who translate in a very small group. Why should I not have the opportunity to translate for certain projects, just because some moderators choose to translate alone or only in a small group, for selfish reasons? I think selfishness has no place on a volunteer platform. So, again, I thought that moderating as many projects as possible would give me the opportunity to give the opportunity to those responsible to translate for as many projects as possible. You can see on my profile that I also have teams of 11, 12 and 14 members. I have also encouraged and helped responsible people in my community to become moderators.

This is how I ended up investing my free time in Viki, which is not a negligible amount of time. I have mentioned on my profile about how much time I spend approximately on Viki.

If until now I was content with being able to have an unlimited number of projects (I’ve always kept under 17-18 projects at the same time), and thus the chance to push aside those with serious problems, this will now disappear. With the new requirements, all you are doing is giving much better chances to those with serious problems to become moderators. Unfortunately, my community is full of these irresponsible volunteers. Personally, I will not translate for such people with serious native language problems. Viki is not a school for native language, native language is learned at real life school.

In conclusion, I guarantee 100% that in my community there will be a majority of moderators with quality problems. In such a situation, I can only complete the projects I have now and seriously consider quitting. All my efforts have been in vain, now I have to sit idly by and watch helplessly as almost illiterate people will moderate projects. It seems that you didn’t want to understand that not everyone has the same amount of time to be a moderator, not everyone wants to get involved in this role, not everyone is responsible. Why contribute on a platform that restricts me from any means of enhancing the quality offered by the community as a whole?

These new requirements, without a quality check in every language, of every volunteer, are an insult to those who have worked so many years and so many months to leave something decent behind. You have eliminated even the last chance to make my community better.

Those of you who are happy, try to put aside your personal interests, and think about the fact that Viki is made up of many communities, each with its own problems and peculiarities. What is good for your community might be very harmful to another community.

Regarding the hope that Viki will respond to our complaints about the poor quality offered by some volunteers, I have come to the conclusion that this will never happen, as they do not have native staff for each language. They didn’t even bother to make NSSA mandatory.


#57

You made good points. IMO, Viki should have implemented the volunteer-screening feature before this one. If we could have started screening volunteers before we had our projects limited, the chances of inexperienced/illiterate users taking up mod roles would have decreased.

We’re all just going to have to stop paying attention to sub whiners because these changes are definitely going to cause huge delays in all languages, including English.


#58

So, automated system created by Viki. We’ll see if they actually understand all the stuff that can prevent an OL mod from completing a project. The transitional period is going to be rough, to say the least. Good luck everyone!

With regards to small language communities, as @dimghro already mentioned, we the native speakers (not Viki) will see a drastic decrease in quality, while perhaps more projects will be completed.

I think you could dedicate more time now to teaching Romanian subbers. I was quite opposed to a subbing “academy” before, as I believe that high quality subbing is not something everybody can learn. But at least it would mean something for a CM if a person has “passed” the academy criteria (don’t really know how it works over there).

They tried, but it was useless. The grading was on voluntary basis and the material translated was one sub at the time, without any context.

Also, lets not deceive ourselves - Viki is happy with the bare minimum quality on all languages (as they haven’t done anything ever to secure it). As long as it stands that the episode is 95% translated. It’s us, the volunteers, who insist on good quality.


#59

personally i do appreciate the changes, i can reach top50 every month and im here everyday for hours, no matter where i apply never having a chance to get a language moderation role just cause im relatively new and i dont really know anyone. then i see some other people being language modesrations in countless of projects, not even having enough time to work on them all, because i see translations of new episodes wait for weeks. and then they still are assigned to new projects even though i don’t see any progress in their current ones. so yes, i do appreciate the changes, because i put so so much effort on here and i feel like i have no chances just because im here shorter than everyone else.


#60

I’m happy you will now have better chance of getting a Mod position :smiley:

In a system and community as big and diverse as Viki is, we need to find a balance where all parties are protected. Meaning, we should make changes which will benefit young contributors such as yourself, AND at the same time not damage too much the workflow of more experienced volunteers.